Another thought on evil...

Imagine a person who is the nicest person in the world. This dude isn't a pushover, rather he's the nicest person in the world because he always helps people. He's always putting people before him, and at any opportunity will help someone with a problem, relieve their pain, listen to them talk and basically anything they need.

This person would probably have a profound effect on people. Sure, they wouldn't rid the world of evil, but they would definitely make a lot of difference. He would give anything to cure the world of all the evil in it, only problem is, he doesn't have the power.

But imagine if he had the power. Oh boy. Goodbye aids. Goodbye earthquakes. Goodbye murder, rape, tsunamis, nuclear weapons, and so on. He would purge the world of all evil, and would do it without hurting one single person. How would he get rid of terrorists without killing them? Well, I'm not really sure, but this person would be all-powerful, so could certainly get rid of the evil they do without doing evil to them.

Imagine what this person could achieve. We'd have an evil-free world. Great. What was the recipe? The will to help others, and omnipotence (all-powerful).

Hang on a second. Isn't this meant to be what God is? At least the Christian God?

He's all-powerful. And, they say he has the will to save the world. Or at least wasn't that why Jesus died? But Jesus didn't have to die. Don't tell me he did. God IS all-powerful, so God wasn't bound by any law. He didn't have to obey any law. If he wanted to, he could have saved the world without his son having to die.

As it is, we're told his son has died. And all these good things promised are awaiting the holy Christians in heaven. But what about now?

God has both the will to save us, and the means, yet nothing. He could rid the world of evil with just a single thought. He wouldn't have to raise a finger. He'd simply think it and it would be done. Because remember, he's perfect. And one must be perfectly powerful (read... all-powerful) to be perfect.

So the question remains, why is evil still here? Any moderately good human would destroy evil if they had the means, but the perfect God so many follow?

And people say he's good...

He's either not good, or he has some other reason for letting the evil remain. But what other reason? Sin? But that's not fair. Since he created us, gave us free will, knew the exact outcome and consequence of our actions and his actions, then put the tree in the garden, thereby giving humans the opportunity to sin! So sin finds its origins in God. So the idea that he's punishing us is a joke.

I sense this a stupid, doomed to-the-bin question, but I'll ask it anyway. Does anyone have a better explanation of evil?

The Problem of Evil

When I was a Christian, I used to ignore the problem of evil. And though I never had a concrete answer as to why there was evil, I nevertheless continued believing for many years regardless. Sure, there was evil, but even if I don't know why it's here, surely God must! Or so I thought. Every now and then I'd ask the question "If God created everything, then did he create evil?". But if that was true, then how could God be good? Despite lacking an intelligent answer, I believed in God for many more years.

But since turning to atheism, or more accurately, non-belief, I've been able to have a better look at evil. Where as I used to ask questions only in so far as they did not change my belief in God, now I can look at things and not be worried about what effect they might have on my beliefs. I'm more interested in making intelligent, reasonable observations then using faith to support a worldview. so if anyone has any advice, criticism to make of me, feel free.

Anyway, back to evil. Now when I look at evil, I see something completely incompatible with an all-loving God. With the amount of evil in the world, how can one believe in a benevolent God? Especially an all-powerful one? A much better man called Epicurus summed this up nicely.

"Is god willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him god?

Epicurus

The above quote highlights all logical possibilities regarding the presence of evil and a God. Reality simply doesn't add up. Christians believe that God is omnipotent (all-powerful) and all-loving, while seeing evil everyday. If God is all-powerful and all-loving, then where did evil come from? Surely, most Christians would say that God is willing that evil should be gone, and that he has the power to get rid of it, but if that's true, then why does it linger on?

What perfect, all-loving God would let any evil remain in the world if he had both the will and the power to destroy it forever? What perfect, all-loving God would create humans with the capacity not only to murder each other, but also with the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and terrible methods of torture?

Some will say that evil remains only because God lets it, but why would he let it remain if he had the power to remove it?

Even if we go back to the beginning of the bible into the garden of Eden, it still doesn't add up. God seriously fucked up. Here he is, creating the world in all it's glory in JUST 7 DAYS! He made it good and saw that it was good. He created man and gave him dominion over all the animals. Oh man, this God was the best. No one could outsmart him. No one could foresee more than him. No one was more powerful than he.

Adam and Eve are hanging out in the garden, having the time of their lives (well it's their first day isn't it...), naming the animals, when God gives them one rule. JUST ONE RULE! The rule was, don't eat from tree in the middle of the garden for you will surely die.

OK STOP.

Why the fuck did he put the tree there in the first place? Excuse the language, but wouldn't a God of supreme attributes know better? I mean, even I would know not to put a tree in the garden of Eden if I knew it would kill someone I'd created. But God, in his divine excellence, not only put the tree there, but he put it there with full knowledge that Adam and Eve would eat from it. You'd think he was trying to set them up, you know, frame them. And what do you know... they eat it, God gets mad, kicks them out of the garden, and eventually they die. Couldn't God have solved all the problems of the last 6000 years (well we are talking Genesis...), by simply not putting the tree in the garden? He would have been able to let humans go on living blissfully free, completely unaware of good and evil... but no, he created man in his own image, gave him a rule, gave him exactly what he needed to break that rule, cursed man, and now we get blamed for it? Give me a break.

An all-loving, all-powerful God is a logical impossibility. It is completely in contradiction to reality. I can't believe it took me so long to understand this. I'm open to a good explanation of why God put evil in the world, but please, tell me something I haven't heard before.

Christianity and the 'Thousands' of 'Proofs'

I think it's funny that when talking about Christianity, a Christian will start to go on and on about the proofs of God's existence, whether it be the complexity within nature, an innate desire for god, morality, and so on. Sure, all these things can be used to argue for a supreme being's existence, but the God of Christianity? Not one single bit.

Let's back up a little. This only occurred to me recently, but it's been on my mind ever since. I got talking with a Christian and made the mistake of claiming God cannot exist, after which he asked me to back up my claim. Fair enough - if I make any claim, I should be able to back it up. But that's another idea for another time. Back to the topic...

When talking about Christianity, or any specific religion, there are very few arguments for it's existence, yet so many of it's adherents will list countless arguments. Say where talking about Christianity, a Christian being a person who believes the Jesus is "the way, the truth and the life" and who believes in the bible as the inspired word of God. There are only two arguments. Yep, that's it - the bible and Jesus.

For the Christian God to be real, Jesus must have lived, died, and rose, and the bible must have been the word of god. If either of these two things is not true, then it follows that Christianity is not true.

Any other argument for God's existence is simply an argument for the existence of A God. It says nothing about the identity of this God. Take the first cause argument. Everything that exists must have a cause. The universe exists. Therefore, God exists as the un-caused first cause of the universe. Even if we accept this argument as valid, all we have proven is that God exists. Which God? No idea. This argument, and many others like it only argue that God exists. What many Christians fail to realise is that they cannot use these arguments to back up their belief in the Christian God, because these arguments prove nothing about the identity of the God. Sure, it's all well and good to accept that God exists. The problem arises when we start trying to assign names or identities to it.

This applies to any religion with the belief in a God. The specific religion believes in a God with an identity, but almost all arguments for God's existence only postulate his existence, and not his identity.

So next time a Christian (or any theist for that matter) starts rattling of proofs of God's existence, remind him that the only two that count in his case, are proofs for the bible as the divine word of God, and proofs of Jesus life, death and ressurection. The silly thing is that these two proofs are tied together. What book beside the bible testifies to Jesus existence? I know of none, but feel free to let me know.

What this also means is that if there is proof that the bible is inconsistent, shows signs of human interference, or has any defects, it is likely that it is not the word of God and therefore the Christian God does not exist. Same with Jesus - if there is no substantial proof that he lived, died and rose then he certainly was not God.

Of course, no one can prove that Jesus does not exist, as it's impossible to prove that something doesn't exist. But we can make a rational assessment of the facts at hand and decide with intelligence whether it is reasonable to believe in his existence. There are countless sites and YouTube videos about this subject, so I won't go into it.

I for one, do not believe there is any good reason to believe in Jesus (at the very least, his resurrection), and nor the bible.

Another reason why I don't believe in God.